"The mayor at times objected to the questions Muskovitz asked, saying he isn't an accountant and is no longer a practicing attorney."

Is this another fable: was he ever a practicing attorney?

Looks like the mayor needs to step up and take some responsibility and admit that the city's finances weren't as dire as he said they were.

His next step, would be to fire Miller Dawson. I've lost count now, how many times she's admitted that she doesn't know what the state of affairs the city's finances are in.

It seems the mayor left one important thing out. With his past transgressions well documented, I wouldn't say he even qualifies as a mayor. At least not compared to other mayors in the area.

If the citizens can't see through this sham, then you are really blind followers. He is a disgrace to the city of Akron.

It isn't as though the city has a checking account and a savings account and can just transfer funds from one to the other. Often is it illegal and would result in forfeiture or repayment of funds to use money designated for one project to fund another - no matter how worthy.

We need a Federal investigation.....I smell corruption.

Looks like the mayor is caught yet again in a web of lies that he and his "boys" have spun.

What else is the Union going to say, otherwise they continue to look foolish for having laid off their own brothers, while the other Unions take cuts to save theirs....pretty simple really, unless of course you're stubborn and foolish !

I'm thinking that both sides play a role in this. Greed is one of the 7 deadly sins for a reason.

Same old story!! And again, how can you trust a woman who has TWO last names??? Where are the FEDS?

Susannah Muskovitz knows how to read Mr. Plusquellic, but does your Finance Director know how to too add or subtract? The best answer to a budget question is “I don’t know.” You have put the city at risk of a major problem to either settle a score or for a big budget shortfall, which is it?
Do you know why there were all those firefighter’s there? They for once wanted to see you squirm and worm your way out of answers. You had all those rookies train till the end and then all of a sudden it’s hit the road? What a lapse in judgment, this had to have been seen coming. You just cannot miss how many million?
But the fallacy of it all is when you show such emotional deceit it is pathetic. Can you not even stand up and be a man about it? But this is the same old Don, just a different day.

I would still like to know why the all of the cities flags were not at half staff on Wed.? We had to be the only city in the USA that failed to honor the Vets

I feel for the firefighters, but the reality is the union gambled and lost and so did a fine young class of firefighters. Greed? Maybe. It is a shame no concessions were made in this very challenging economic environment. Yes the other unions made concessions and that made all the difference. I find it comical when many post about specific city expenditures with no understanding of budgeting and how certain items are funded. Gang......cut backs are being made across the nation...that is a reality.

OK... here is the harsh reality. There are a few of you that post on every article, rant and rave the mayor is no good, got your hopes up that a recall would pass, get a sense you are gaining momentum, but in the end you know you are a handful of bitter folks that post and represent a very small minority in Akron. Look, most of the city is happy with the Mayor and the state of the city. This is a great town. Simple. I know for you folks it is frustrating because it seems nothing touches the Mayor....but there is nothing out there to touch him. He is respected at a state and national level. While you sit and post he is admired and that drives you crazy does it not.

This bit from the Plain Dealer I feel is a great explanation of what describes what you folks want-
We don't want a mayor with guts and vision. We don't need a mayor who understands that decaying, rust belt cities desperately need someone who floats big ideas -- someone who isn't afraid to fail. We want one of those dime-a-dozen mayors who do little or nothing significant -- but do it politely and rarely offend.

”Big thinking precedes great achievement”
- Wilfred Peterson

akronisdynamic:

Don't speak for us or tell us what we want. You cannot know, as you haven't had an original thought since you first sipped the Plusquellic Kool-Aid.

As easily dismissed as a person is for blindly hating the mayor regardless of circumstance, you are equally easily dismissed for blindly supporting every move he makes. Your opinion simply doesn't matter, since it's the exact same every time.

Just wanted to save you the trouble of posting such lengthy entries in the future. No need to thank me.

Dynamic, so if they testified the money is not being touched as an emergency fund, what constitutes an emergency? Laying off nearly 1/4 of the police department? That's not an emergency..?

How come the independent, outside accountant can find the money? If it's untouchable or untransferable, wouldn't she know that too? Nowhere in this article does it state the money can not be moved around.


I don't generally disagree with your posts, but when the finance director comes up with new figures that change every couple weeks, or just plain can't answer simple questions...something bad is going on. We gave these people their jobs, they work for us. I want to know the truth about city finances before my safety is in jeopardy because of their mismanagement of OUR money.

People are happy with the Mayor? Maybe, but I think if more people paid attention they wouldn't be.

Akronisdynamic is spot on...nice summation !

When is are the results of the Department of Justice investigation going to be released?

@ akronisdynamic - Who said concessions weren't offered?

You would have done better to say that the union didn't agree to the city's demands. At least that would have been an accurate statement.

Also, you should do a double check of your information about the other unions meeting the concessions. Again, not all voted for them, ergo city workers being laid off other than the firemen.

Now that you've been given better information, so as to adjust your posts for better accuracy, here's a quote that will apply, should you choose to ignore the factual information.

"The partisan, when he is engaged in a dispute, cares nothing about the rights of the question, but is anxious only to convince his hearers of his own assertions. " --Plato--

Hometown Girl,
On Memorial Day (not Veteran's Day) the flag is displayed at half staff until noon and then after noon at full staff.

Otherwise, the only time it should be at half staff is in mourning for designated, principal government leaders and upon presidential or gubernatorial order. Maybe there was an order that Akron missed. Or maybe other communities did it on their own.

I saw many at half staff on Tuesday, possibly in tribute to the 13 dead at Ft. Hood.

I thought the state audit just criticized Akron for transferring funds between different accounts and said it was illegal?

Akronisdynamic,

Yeah, you pretty much nailed it.

Does this song and dance make the senior guys feel better for sticking the knife in the backs of 38 "brothers?" Is it really that cathartic?

Layoffs:

APD: 0
AFD: 38

Looks to me like the City of Akron bigwigs were exposed as either being liars or incompetent.

***''Today, where are you?'' Muskovitz asked, referring to the deficit.

''I don't know,'' Miller-Dawson answered.***

REALLY??!!??!!

As far as I'm concerned the flags should be at half mass every day as long as we continue to lose soldiers overseas.

On the firefighters the Mayor doesn't know what he's doing and neither does the Financial Director.

=================
AkronIsDynamic wrote:

It is a shame no concessions were made in this very challenging economic environment. Yes the other unions made concessions and that made all the difference.
=================

Where contract concessions made (by SOME) unions based on inaccurate (or just plain FALSE) financial forecasts as outlined by the Mayor's office?

Don't forget, the Fire Fighters were not the only union that rejected contract concessions.

The 460 member strong AFSCME "overwhelmingly rejected an agreement with the city today [Sept. 29] that would have rescinded the layoff notices and guaranteed no layoffs through the end of this year".

Well that's it then . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
The firefighters should've been in charge of the City all along!
Who knew?

@Linda

Half-mast: On water
Half-staff: On land

But your sentiment is supported in this household.

I see the Mayors girls are out this morning.IT'S CALLED REVENGE PEOPLE .There was no short fall. The firefighter union was the smart ones in not being bluffed by the Don.Plusquellic, who was at times testy and emotional,(IN OTHER WORDS I NEED A DRINK!!!!)The mayor at times objected to the questions Muskovitz asked, saying he isn't an accountant and is no longer a practicing attorney.Don is a CPA isn't he and Has an Juris Doctor degree dosn't he.
''The charter says I am the mayor of Akron,''His rolaty is showing,the god king FUEHRER is speaking.Bow yourselves The_Original_Jason,Gain Some More Reality,akronisdynamic.Dare anyone question my authority.Don is proclaiming!!!

''The charter says I am the mayor of Akron,Well that means you are responsible for the downfall of this city.Then why are your funkeys pointing fingers at everyone else.Listen to your leader.
''The charter says I am the mayor of Akron" THE BUCK STOPS HERE PERIOD.

stephend6,

I can think of 38 people who don't think the firefighter union was the smart one. But who cares about them when there's personal grudges to settle, right?

Get Joe Kidder in front of a federal grand jury...then you'll see the city government's true colors!!!!!Ms. Muskovitz, I'll be in touch. Or maybe Warner would be interested in what I have to say.

The_Original_Jason
''The charter says I am the mayor of Akron,''His rolaty is showing,the god king FUEHRER is speaking.
The only one with a personal grudge to settle sounds like your god king.And if the ruling of the Akron Civil Service Commission says The Don was wrong and hires them back.Are your Mayors cheerleaders going to blame the Civil Service Commission of holding grudges also?IF AND I MEAN IF Don was professional he would not carry on like he do in front of the Commission.

stephend,

GSMR brought up a good point. When does the opposition condone transfers between budgets? The haters from the summer would disagree with the haters from autumn. I guess it's not just the temperature that changes with the seasons, huh?

coleenbreen,

Why don't you just contact Warner directly?

http://www.warnermendenhall.com/

akronisdynamic nailed this one. All the folks bemoaning the mayor, keep in mind the AFD union had a huge hand in the layoffs as did it's constituency and now they want to call sour grapes? C'mon Man! They gambled and lost. The union did not do the smart thing, nor, in my opinion the right thing.

Is this an emergency situation? Not. Even. Close.

I wonder how much the fire union and the city is now paying for all of this now poeple. Lawyers, experts, city time. Heck maybe, the costs of all of this now would have just been enough to keep them all?

@stephen6... They mayor's comments were appropriate. He is not the city finance director nor the law director. His job as the mayor does not include knowing ALL the details of other people's jobs.

Something is wrong with the city finance director though. And it has nothing to do with having two last names (voltman). Why can't she produce documentation on how she calculated her projected deficit. In this economy, the projected deficit should be revised monthly at a minimum and be supported by documentation. And she should have known where the city shortfall stands on the day she had to appear before the Akron Civil Service Commission on that same matter. She is not doing her job well if she cannot do these things. However, that doesn't mean there is not a budget deficit.

@ The Original Jason:
"Why don't you just contact Warner directly?"

I think I will...there are a couple of interesting bits of history I believe he, or someone he recommends will be VERY interested in...the day of reckoning is at hand!

Where is the 'equal treatment' of the city employees during this 'time of crisis'?

The Mayor only laid-off 3 of AFSCME's 460 members when they rejected the City's concession offer.

The Mayor laid-off 38 of the smaller Fire Union's 368 membership when they rejected the City's concession offer.

Sounds like this hearing is uncovering the randomness of the Mayor's choices of where to cut, as well as if those cuts were needed in the first place.

P.S.

Why did the 2009 Akron City budget allocate 2.98% LESS money than was spent in 2008 by the Police Department?

Why did the 2009 Akron City budget allocate 2.19% LESS money than was spent in 2008 by the Fire Department?

Just in case you are wondering, the revised 2009 budget gives the "Office of the Mayor" 8.08% MORE than was spent in 2008; the "Finance Dept" 9.39% MORE than was spent in 2008; and the "Legislative" department 10.53% MORE than was spent in 2008.

Check out the numbers for yourself on page 4 of:

http://www.ci.akron.oh.us/finance/2009%203rd%20Quarter%20Report.pdf

@colleen...: The day of reckoning came with the recall vote. You guys lost. Get over it( sore losers).

@AkronIsDynamic: Come play pool tonight. The best time is after 8. Call me.

colleenbreen,

I hope it is. I can't stand the daily predictions that the end is near.

Why do the firefighters and cops need unions. If they don't like the pay "quit"

This Muskovtz lady looks like a prune.

TOJ said "I can think of 38 people who don't think the firefighter union was the smart one."

Really? Did you talk to all of them? How dare you posit what they think. Maybe you should just worry about your own bootstraps.

ZombieKoala,

I guess I could see the look from the front on their faces since I wasn't shoving a knife in their back.

AFD: 38
APD: 0

The_Original_Jason post:I can think of 38 people who don't think the firefighter union was the smart one.

The_Original_Jason post:I can think of 38 people who don't think the firefighter union was the smart one.The 38 are not fighting the union before the Civil Service Commission .And I know you have not talked to them.

TOJ - I'm sorry that you don't understand brotherhood. Really. Sorta sad. You keep looking out for #1, buddy!

rm post:@stephen6... They mayor's comments were appropriate. He is not the city finance director nor the law director. His job as the mayor does not include knowing ALL the details of other people's jobs.
He is attacking others on what his incompetent staff is doing.So his comments were not appropriate.

The_Original_Jason
GSMR brought up a good point. When does the opposition condone transfers between budgets.
Gain Some More Reality Post:
I thought the state audit just criticized Akron for transferring funds between different accounts and said it was illegal?If something was found illegal then who was prosecuted,And why is it still going on.So by your own post , The Mayor is doing illegal activities.Think before you post.Mayor lovers.

Well, it took til 10 am, but the misinformation mongers are out and plying their trade.

Points to remember.

1. The fire Union offered concessions and had them rejected.

2. The 38 laid off firemen unanimously supported their union.

3. The fire Union wasn't the only union to reject the city's concessions.

I'd quote Plato again, but they obviously didn't get it the first time.

ZombieKoala,

I agree, if pushing the bottom ranks of your membership under the bus is the way, I don't understand "brotherhood." No disagreement there.

Maybe it's the cops that understand brotherhood.

stleo
akron, oh

Posted 12:08 PM, 11/13/2009 @colleen...: The day of reckoning came with the recall vote. You guys lost. Get over it( sore losers).

@AkronIsDynamic: Come play pool tonight. The best time is after 8. Call me.

You too fellers gonna t-e-a bag each other while looking at pictures of the Don??

June stephend6,

There's a big difference between "illegal" and policies and procedures.


November stephend6,

You can't switch funds between accounts. While it doesn't violate the law, it violates state practices on municipal accounting.

@ stleo:(what does that stand for...stupid trog lacking evolutionary opportunities)?

As far as your comment, "The day of reckoning came with the recall vote. You guys lost. Get over it( sore losers)."

Recalls are for amateurs...I'm talking impeachment, maybe federal prison time for all involved!

@stephen6... There is a difference between the Mayor being responsible for his employees and knowing every detail of their jobs. If he was being asked specific details about the budget that would have been best answered by the finance director, then it was totally appropriate to reply that it wasn't his job. He did so by stating he is not an accountant and that he is the Mayor. He is however, responsible for their actions at the end of the day.

Wow this story already got buried by the Beacon.

I wonder what kind of turnout there will be when the testimony resumes on November 19 at 8:30 a.m. at the continuation of this hearing.

JohnBoy - I would say the title makes it difficult to find.

TOJ - I give up. I'm glad that when I call 9-1-1, you don't show up. A big thank you to all the men and women that do, for they understand altruism. They demonstrate it every day at work. Of course they will demonstrate it when the city tries to steal from their mediocre wages.

@dduck5hit: fah-que! I'm friends with a few of the posters here. I'm sure you have NO friends (why would you?). If you are this insecure, you should try getting a life.


@Colleenbrine: An impeachment would not stop you from whining.

@colleenbreen: St. Leo The Great was a pope, aroung 440 A.D. He was the man that convinced Attila The Hun not to attack western europe. He was an aristocrat that gave up his fortune for others. He helped unite the Roman Catholic Church, avoiding years ofstruggle and war. I look at him as a hero.

The_Original_Jason posted:GSMR brought up a good point.point I thought the state audit just criticized Akron for transferring funds between different accounts and said it was illegal?GSMR.
Merriam-Webster's Dictionary of Law:il⋅le⋅gal,adjective 1. forbidden by law or statute.
You cant wiggle your way out of this one.

rm Post: If he was being asked specific details about the budget that would have been best answered by the finance director, then it was totally appropriate to reply that it wasn't his job.No the correct response should have been ,I will defer that question to the finance director. Not Plusquellic, who was at times testy and emotional.

Were all meeting at the Firehouse bar and grill on West avenue for happy hour. To celebrate the morale victory of lying, cheating, and stealing from Akron. Don will not be driving there. So come on over and CHOKE one down with Donnie boy. Jk but thats what comes to mind after reading this article. More budget on his exspense card.

dduckster
You ok champ. You are a angry person are you not? Find peace...it will be ok. Promise.

“Each one has to find his peace from within. And peace to be real must be unaffected by outside circumstances.”
Gandhi

June stephend6,

OK, you got me. Since it's illegal, the fire union needs to stop proposing this illegal maneuver.

The_Original_Jason

That is funny..you got him. Go hit the bong!

Now all stephend6 needs to post is touché!! The_Original_Jason nice witticism!!

==========
Stephen6 wrote:

I thought the state audit just criticized Akron for transferring funds between different accounts and said it was illegal?
==========

Actually it was the City's spending of more money that had been allocated for those different accounts that got a 5th or 6th straight year of wrist slapping from the Ohio State Auditor's office review.

The_Original_Jason.The_Original_Jason

Posted 11:12 AM, 11/13/2009 stephend,

GSMR brought up a good point.
AND GSMR POST STATED:I thought the state audit just criticized Akron for transferring funds between different accounts and said it was illegal?GAIN GOT YOU.Now you and akronisdynamic go kiss and go away

Overtaxed Voter Thank you,Gain was posting more lies.

So the fire union is saying the right thing by stating transfer of funds is all that's needed ,as long as the Mayor don't spend more money then the allocation of those different accounts allow for.Sorry The_Original_Jason, akronisdynamic.I guess I can go Go hit the bong!

Akron, Oh

Posted 03:19 PM, 11/13/2009 The_Original_Jason

That is funny..you got him. Go hit the bong!

Now all stephend6 needs to post is touché!! The_Original_Jason nice witticism!!

Dude, please practice what you preach. :)
It will all be okay I promise, keep praying at the church of Donnie Boy and your troubles will be in your rearview mirror.

It is not Illegal to transfer monies from the Tax Revenue fund or the JEDD Tax fund in to the general fund.

The City has done this many times in the past.

Funds set aside for certain capital improvements can not be swapped.

The funds in question can easily be transferred, the city has chosen not to do this however.

Also DMD assertion about "pay me now or pay me later", as far as time due to those laid off is insane. The later, would be 25-30 years down the road, not the year the city is facing a fincial melt down.

TOJ...

So you know and have talked to all the 38 firefighters laid off?

Have you talked to any?

Do you know how much each officer was asked to give?

Do you know how much each Firefigther was asked to give?

Did you know that it IS NOT illegal to transfer monies from tax accounts to the general fund?

Why does everyone attack 'AkronisDynamic'? He is just a city hall plant, paid to monitor and offer excuses to anti Akron leadership posts.

The City of Akron signed a contract with this union and its workers. Now, they don't want to live up to their end of the agreement, and thusly told the firefighters "We dont wanna pay what we said we would. Either deal with that, or we lay you off". That is not a concession... That is extortion.

I'll say this, again. AkronIsDynamic is a friend of mine. He doesn't work for city hall; he isn't gay; and he critcizes the mayor as much as you guys do. Just, not on this issue. The personal attacks take away from the words you people post. If you want to convince anyone of anything, you must believe the strength of your arguement will work, alone. If you need to use personal attacks, you don't really believe what you are saying. Peace, OUT.

stleo Notre Dame and Pitt would be great game to watch. You up for it?

dduckster Nice teeth

Beautiful night you all. Step outside and check it out.

@ many

The union may feel for the moment this is the right move. The reality is a month from now this will pass and the unfortunate rookies will be without their job. Negotiations will only get tougher and the unions will either make meaningful concessions or pay a greater price. Police and fire unions are facing this all over the nation. For us in the private sector there is no argument...you get the slip and go home. These economic times are historic and will continue to get worse for government so brace yourself. We can debate this till we are blue in the face but there WILL be more to come and citizens will find someone to blame be it the Mayor or the President for that matter. But, realize this is much bigger then Don. He keeps his eye on the ball and is doing the best he can in my opinion. I just do not see how folks could question his commitment to community. But, I would gamble and say in newspapers all over the nation there is debate online similar in nature to this...though many cities are facing MUCH MORE CRISIS then Akron. He has his detractors with no solutions to offer, see the posts above, but funny thing is it does not change the course of this fine city.

Sir Winston Churchill:
Kites rise highest against the wind-not with it.

@stephend6 said "Don is a CPA isn't he and Has an Juris Doctor degree dosn't he."

Why do you think the mayor is a CPA?

@stephend6, not everything illegal results in prosecution. Audit usually results in warnings before moving on to fines or criminal prosecution.

@stephend6, you have not got anyone. Your posts do not even make sense. Copy and posting other people's words over and over again does not mean you "got" someone.

@stephend6, what lie did I post? I posted a question.

I guess you do not know the difference between posting a comment and asking a question. You still need those comprehension classes I see.

Gain Some More Reality your posted question got The_Original_Jason thinking it was your point.The_Original_Jason.The_Original_Jason

Posted 11:12 AM, 11/13/2009 stephend,

GSMR brought up a good point.Don let you out the bed so early,He must be getting old.I mean you, akronisdynamic and The_Original_Jason out at the same time?But what i do know is yes men lovers when I read their post.

stleo POST:I'll say this, again. AkronIsDynamic is a friend of mine.AND? That proves what?

stephend6

copy post copy post

have a nice weekend all!

akronisdynamic copy post copy post,Better then being slow and a bad lover.

@stephen6: So, stop calling him names. The name calling looks silly, and unproductive.

stephend6 posted
akronisdynamic copy post copy post,Better then being slow and a bad lover.

I am stephend6
Copy post copy post......

Is stephend6 suggesting he is in love with akronisdynamic?

enough with the GD insults!

stleo,Gain Some More Reality,akronisdynamic,The_Original_Jason
The Dons love harem is growing.No wander hes called Don wan.You go Donny boy.The player is back in town.

@stephend6 are you trying to out do Loren on who can have the worse undecipherable post? What are you trying to say?